Intern
Posted:
Dec 1, 2011, 3:46 PM
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TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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I have only very recently discovered the 3 marvelous series that Disney made in the late 80's to early 90's. To be specific: DuckTales (1987-1990), Darkwing Duck (1991-1992) and Quack Pack (1996). There might be more great series of that time (I really don't know), but those were truly remarkably good, and I'll give you some of my thoughts on them.
DuckTales was really great, at least the first season with all its adventures. The later seasons seemed to lack adventuring a bit, becoming mostly Scrooge and his family vs. The Beagle Boys. I am actually glad they replaced Bubba the Caveduck with Fenton Crackshell alias Gizmoduck, as some of his episodes were quite good and he could at least talk in longer sentences. The animation and voice acting of the whole series were generally quite good, even though I think The Beagle Boys had too goofy and irritating voices. Alan Young as Scrooge McDuck can't be beaten in that role, and Russi Taylor did a good job as the kids while Terry McGovern sounds like what a somewhat goofy sidekick like Launchpad McQuack is supposed to sound like. But what really stood out in this regard was good old June Foray as Magica DeSpell! She was simply amazing in the role, and I wish they had made fewer encounters with The Beagle Boys and more with her, if only to hear her sarcastic "Scroogie, darling(k)!" more often. Absolutely fantastic to hear her not as the sweet Granny or the stereotypical Witch Hazel, but with a great accent and maniacal laughter nearly sending shivers down my spine! Simply wonderful! :D
And what can I say about Darkwing Duck? Seriously one of the best animated series I've seen, without much of the usual Disney "mushy stuff", but with lots of tight action comedy coupled with great voice talents. It really opened my eyes for the talent that is Jim Cummings, with his roles as Drake Mallard alias Darkwing Duck and his annoying neighbour Herb Muddlefoot. I showed an episode to my sister, and she commented that they all had very distinct voices in this show, especially for the main children Gosalyn Mallard and Herbert J."Honker" Muddlefoot. Amazing work by the voice cast, writers and animators of this show. One thing struck me and that was the reuse of nearly all villains and side characters. Many of them had at least 2 episodes, and these revisits into the minds and criminal activities of the villains made it very enjoyable since a very good continuity was being upheld through the series. After all, how many world-conquering or city-crushing villains can one city possibly have? I know that they aired the series and released the DVD's with wrong episode sorting, but I went through the Wikipedia list and watched them after production number, with the exception of the pilot episode "Darkly Dawns the Duck", showing great continuity through almost the whole series. With that being said, there were some episodes that wasn't as enjoyable, maybe in the mid-to-later half of the series, but the general feel was very good and many episodes were truly ingenious and worth watching again (e.g. "In like Blunt"). The darker tone of the series really appealed to me as an adult, without making episodes senseless shoot/beat-'em-up's, and the relationship between Drake/Darkwing and Gosalyn was beautifully laid out with lots of psychology. (Still, I wonder why Drake even tried to get her to stay behind, or at least he should have locked her door and window as using the window seemed to be her favourite escape plan.)
The last few days I've been watching the 39 episodes of Quack Pack. And it leaves me wondering why they didn't make more than one season, as DuckTales with its 100 episodes and Darwking Duck with its 91 really outnumbers this series. I was very sceptical to the whole premise, and even more so since the episode theme song was really lame (in my opinion). To my delighful surprise, the show was much better than feared, and actually quite enjoyable. Voice cast was good, animation likewise, and the more separated personalities of Huey, Dewey and Louie gave them a breath of fresh air and showed that they weren't always as likeminded and inseparable as usually depicted. Even though the comedy wasn't always as successful, its writers showed good story skills and its personality gags and character one-liners gave me a good chuckle at times. As this series probably was meant for teenagers roughly the same age as its colourful trio, I wonder why they didn't continue with the series, since I'd think that the formula should work well for many teens/pre-teens. They weren't afraid to show guns and dangerous booby-traps in Quack Pack, whilst tastefully keeping them in line with good cartoon violence tradition and not make them actually harm its main characters (too much). Overall an enjoyable series, which I'd think would appeal to many viewers.
That brings me to this question: WHY IN ALL THAT'S GOOD IN TV ANIMATION DID THEY STOP MAKING SUCH AWESOMENESS??? I didn't know about these series until quite recently, which makes me wonder what else I might have missed out on. I'll hopefully discover that in time, but unless I'm really mistaken, all Disney seems to be good for these days is making pre-teen and early teenage girls become even more warped in their minds with Hannah Montana and other craptastically uncool shows. WHERE DID YOU GO WRONG?
Sorry for the long post and somewhat ranty tone, but I just had to vent a little, whilst trying to find something new to fill the gap after the unbelievably good shows I've recently had the pleasure to discover for the first time. :)
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Supervising Animator
Posted:
Dec 1, 2011, 4:00 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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I myself have recently gotten into Darkwing Duck and agree with you--absolutely awesome show.They even had a comic series by Boom complete with an awesome Duck Tales crossover for the finale.
As for what Disney has right now--well there is one animated gem amongst all the tween sitcoms IMO. Phineas and Ferb is rather fun--with some clever twists on what would otherwise be seen as standard plots--although nothing is ever predictable when it comes down to the Doofenshmirtz and Perry the Platypus plots.
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"Homer,we just brought Flanders back from the dead. Did you use the notebook to make a flock of penguins peck him to death?"
Marge-"Murder He Wrote"-a Simpsons Comic story.
(This post was edited by Glowworm on Dec 1, 2011, 4:01 PM)
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Directing Animator / Contributor
Posted:
Dec 1, 2011, 4:51 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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I didn't know about these series until quite recently, which makes me wonder what else I might have missed out on. I'll hopefully discover that in time, but unless I'm really mistaken, all Disney seems to be good for these days is making pre-teen and early teenage girls become even more warped in their minds with Hannah Montana and other craptastically uncool shows. WHERE DID YOU GO WRONG?
The Disney teen/tweencoms may not appeal to you or I, but it's a safe bet that we're also not in the age group or demographic that those show are aimed at. They put butts in seats and earn the Mouse House ratings, which is exactly what they're supposed to do. Live-action is also cheaper and quicker to produce than animation.
That said, it would be nice to get some decent Disney toons on the tube again besides just Phineas & Ferb (not a terrible show, I can take it or leave it myself, but Disney shouldn't put all of their animated eggs in one basket). A new show starring Mickey and the gang which doesn't just appeal to tiny tots and some new properties and franchises would be most welcome. However, money is tight these days, and Disney seems to more content to rely on 3rd party acquisitions rather than pour money into new original series.
There are some new Disney shows in the works, such as 7D, a new series starring the Seven Dwarfs, and a new show starring Flora, Fauna and Merriweather from Sleeping Beauty in which the fairy trio aid a new princess-in-training (the title escapes me right now), but alas, those are both preschool shows, I believe. A new all-ages Disney toon would be great, especially with the same level of quality as the Disney Afternoon shows.
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An unemployed court jester is nobody's fool.
(This post was edited by Starburst on Dec 1, 2011, 5:07 PM)
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Intern
Posted:
Dec 4, 2011, 7:24 AM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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The Disney teen/tweencoms may not appeal to you or I, but it's a safe bet that we're also not in the age group or demographic that those show are aimed at. They put butts in seats and earn the Mouse House ratings, which is exactly what they're supposed to do. Live-action is also cheaper and quicker to produce than animation. Thanks for the comments, especially about new shows. :)
I think you're going too easy on them though. The ends doesn't always justify the means. They are Disney, and even in these tougher economic times they seem to be doig rather well. So they can afford to make quality, but instead they choose the easy route to money.
In the eternal words of S. McD: "I made my money by being smarter than the smarties and tougher than the toughies. And I made it square!" Exploiting vulnerable pre-teenage and teenage girls with their distorted reality field doesn't seem square to me. In addition, they severely limit their market age-wise, and in the long term they might not make much money from recurring customers. In other words: when the girls outgrow their idolization of certain teenage stars (which often are in their twenties, but I digress), I highly doubt they'll buy DVD box-sets of their dark past. If they're smart, they'll even be ashamed of it, but in the worst case, they'll just feel they've outgrown the shows.
Compare this to a well-made "all-age" animated show: the aftermarket will start buying box-sets for themselves and their kids to show them what great shows they watched when they were young. And grown-ups like us, who already love well-made animated cartoons will start to buy them as soon as they're available, if they strike our fancies. This means that they'll get loyal fan-bases which'll give them income for years, as you really can't outgrow awesomeness. Sure, it'll probably cost a lot more to produce, but they will retain a good reputation even among adults for making good entertainment, and they can use vast arrays of talents which are still alive and kicking.
For example: the Duckburg universe, while being frequently touched upon in DuckTales, span a lot more than what we see in the 100 episodes they produced. They could use existing comic book stories in the same way they used some Barks stories in DuckTales. They could use more of the characters in Duckburg, for example Mickey and Minnie, Goofy, Donald and his superhero alter ego Paperinik/Phantom Duck. In Europe, Disney comic books are immensely popular, so a show which weren't a total disaster would probably get lots of viewers. Don Rosa's "The Life and Times of Scrooge McDuck" series would do great as a feature-film or even two, as there are so many action sequences and gags and movie-references to suit anyone, if they stayed close to the material. In conclusion: they have vast amounts of good story-potential for their animation department to play with; they just need to hand over them money to do their best and get a good show rolling, and I'm sure they'll get lots back on their investment. But do they dare to do so?
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Directing Animator / Contributor
Posted:
Dec 4, 2011, 8:40 AM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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Eh, that's just business. Disney is a corporation, and as such, turning a profit is always going to be Job 1, not to mention Job 2 and Job 3. The Mouse House didn't forge a bazillion dollar empire by not being profit-focused.
The tweencoms aren't my thing (I wasn't into them even when I was in the age range), but they're not aimed at me, so they're easy to just ignore. They're not going to go away as long as they're profitable. If quality animated output is/were being produced as well, this wouldn't bother me, in an ideal world there's enough room on a 24-hour cable channel to accommodate both.
Would it be nice to see Disney producing some quality animated output? Yes, of course. That would be great. But even with Disney's money, the economy is tight right now. Not even Disney is going to spend a fortune on their animated shows right now. They will in time, but first they need to be convinced that there's an audience for the Disney Afternoon-type stuff outside of the 'too old to buy a ton of merch' internet fanbase.
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An unemployed court jester is nobody's fool.
(This post was edited by Starburst on Dec 4, 2011, 8:44 AM)
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Directing Animator / Contributor
Posted:
Dec 4, 2011, 8:48 AM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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Disney will start producing all-ages shows again in due time. We're just presently living in a time when tweencoms are hot. We can't or shouldn't blame Disney for the continued success of it's tweencoms; it's much easier and safer to keep making something that they know works than it is to take a chance with something new that has a 50% chance of failing. The only reason why Disney keeps making these tweencoms is because kids keep coming back for more. As long as kids keep watching these live action tweencoms, Disney is going to keep making them. After the balloon bursts and they back off, then Disney will move on to something else, but that doesn't really concern me, but those shows aren't made for me and no one is forcing me to watch any of them. We can't really say that Disney is doing anything wrong if fans are still flocking to their TV shows and movies in droves. Also, this is nothing new for the Mouse House. Disney has been doing this sort of thing since the 1950s. Anyone remember the Annette Funicello craze? Spin & Marty? The Misadventures of Merlin Jones? There has been teen entertainment as long as there have been teens. This isn't something that just started a decade ago.
As for Disney's animated shows, the biggest problem that I see is that the Mouse House has become too complacent with it's own success and right now seems quite content to rest on the laurels of Phineas & Ferb. P&F is OK, if a tad repetitive, but Disney shouldn't allow that to be it's only heavy hitter. Except for preschool shows, Disney hasn't been doing much in the animated series department. I'd like to see Disney produce a new series starring 1 or more of the studios trademark characters (Mickey, Donald, Goofy, Minnie, etc.) that's not aimed at tiny tots. I'm guessing that Disney doesn't want to taint the characters' image by making too hard-edged, but Mickey and the gang are certainly capable of more than amusing toddlers, if only someone at the studio would be willing to take that chance.
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Visit mine and my twin brother's blog. It goes down smooth.
www.astralcity.blogspot.com
(This post was edited by SpaceDemon on Dec 4, 2011, 9:00 AM)
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Supervising Animator / Contributor
Posted:
Dec 5, 2011, 11:40 AM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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The Mouse House didn't forge a bazillion dollar empire by not being profit-focused.
I rather think that Disney's empire was founded on Walt's obsessive drive and his belief that the better the product the better the returns (eventually!). That was a long-term gamble which luckily paid off. The chief executive of a bazillion dollar corporation cannot behave in such a reckless manner. Disney makes its money from Parks, Publishing and Co-Productions (ie releasing other people's films!) - they can't afford to make bad animated films, and there's no incentive to make good ones. Better to sit on your laurels than risk losing them. They don't even re-release the old features like they used to, preferring to rely on DVD sales.
They make TV material in the same way and for the same reasons that other kids' channels do. Walt did it because TV wanted him and it financed his Park. Now the Disney name has parental trust, which means ratings. So it is just in competition with the rest.
Good programmes may come and go, but there's no particular vision driving it, so whatever programming is popular (their own or their compeditors) is what they'll focus on. I guess.
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Back by popular demand -
"La-la-La-la.. I can't hear you!"
(This post was edited by peterhale on Dec 5, 2011, 11:54 AM)
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Supervising Animator
Posted:
Dec 6, 2011, 9:46 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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In My Honest Opinion...
I've liked The Disney Ducks...too bad they're overlooked now....
But since the 90's Nostalgia is coming back...who knows? Those shows may return on syndication, with Disney junior having a station and all, The Disney Channel may have room again for nostalgia.
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Thank God for kids who love obscure things-Lee Hazelwood (1929-2007)
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Directing Animator / Contributor
Posted:
Dec 7, 2011, 9:09 AM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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In My Honest Opinion...
I've liked The Disney Ducks...too bad they're overlooked now....
But since the 90's Nostalgia is coming back...who knows? Those shows may return on syndication, with Disney junior having a station and all, The Disney Channel may have room again for nostalgia.
Urgh. Nostalgia. That word makes me cringe, as it's since become the rallying cry of the retro-snob.
And I wouldn't count on any of those shows coming to syndication; the syndicated market is all but dead in the US currently, and Disney has no reason to utilize syndication now that they have 2 cable/satellite channels at their disposal to run their wares, 1 of which is basic cable.
Personally, I don't especially need for the 90's Disney toons to come back to TV (though that would be great, don't get me wrong, it's not really necessary, as many of the Disney Afternoon era shows have been coming to DVD lately; if Disney completes the sets, then I'd be good with that); I'd be more satisfied to see a bevy of new and original shows done in the spirit of those shows with the same level and commitment to quality. You can't move forward by constantly looking back, after all.
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An unemployed court jester is nobody's fool.
(This post was edited by Starburst on Dec 7, 2011, 9:12 AM)
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Directing Animator / Contributor
Posted:
Dec 7, 2011, 8:03 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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"Toon Disney" fell by the wayside. The 80s and 90s cartoon series reruns couldn't sustain the channel for a long term, unfortunately.
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"Don't chew gum on camera. Don't whistle. You may kiss Bob Barker but please don't kill him." -announcer Johnny Olson briefing the audience of potential contestants for "The Price is Right"
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Supervising Animator
Posted:
Dec 7, 2011, 8:14 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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"Toon Disney" fell by the wayside. The 80s and 90s cartoon series reruns couldn't sustain the channel for a long term, unfortunately.
That, and with Video Web Sites...we can watch shows like "Bonkers" and "Ducktales" when we can.
But for the Nostalgia...yeah, it seems that it's coming back full-blast. It's been around since the 1970's when the 1950's was popular again with "Happy Days", "American Graffiti", and "Grease".
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Thank God for kids who love obscure things-Lee Hazelwood (1929-2007)
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Director / Contributor
Posted:
Dec 9, 2011, 5:43 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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Even before then. I remember seeing a Steve Allen show from around the late '50's where he and his crew were remembering the '20's.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gi0dqcR-Otk
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Apprentice
Posted:
Mar 15, 2012, 5:19 AM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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Ah a fellow Disney duck fan. I highly recommend you get the collected books from BOOM Studios Scrooge, DuckTales and Darkwing Duck comics before they are harder to track down.
Disney made a lot of cartoons for TV over the years and they still make 2 and have more on the way including a new series from Craig McCracken of Foster's and Powerpuff Girls fame. In the meantime try Phineas & Ferb it is from two guys that worked on Rocko's Modern Life.
I also recommend checking out Chip 'n Dale: Rescue Rangers, Recess, Timon & Pumba, Phillmore, Kim Possible, TaleSpin, Teacher's Pet, Llyod in Space, The Adventures of the Gummi Bears, American Dragon Jake Long, Hercules the series, Aladdin the series, Mighty Ducks,Super Robot Monkey Team Hyper Force Go, W.I.T.C.H., Pepper Ann, Bonkers, Marsupalami, Shnookems & Meat and of course Gargoyles.
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Intern
Posted:
Mar 15, 2012, 11:51 AM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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Thank you for the recommendations, Aniki. I've been catching up on Warner Bros. 90s stuff lately, but after Histeria! I will need something else to watch. ;)
I still hold on to my view that Disney are missing out on lots of money-making possibilities with their vast Duckburg-and-beyond universe, and that they should take the risk since they're one of the studios with the means to do so. With all their themeparks bringing them continuous revenue they can afford to invest in stuff that might take a while to recoup.
Maybe I'm too old-fashioned and want the 90's back. But then again, I didn't watch them back then and don't have those nostalgic feelings - I like them because they are good. And it's scandalous that they haven't released the full sets on DVD; is that a way to build customer loyalty? Grr.
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Zinc Saucier
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Mar 16, 2012, 9:24 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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It's pretty consistent that nostalgia runs on a 20 yr cycle or so. In the 80s, the 60s were "making a comeback"; in the 90s there was some interest (though only god knows why) in the 70s; I'm sure most people remember the big 80s push in the early 00s- "I Love the 80s" was a huge hit for VH1, for example.
It's simple to see why too. When people reach their mid-late 20s/30s, they are finally in the position to seriously influence consumer products with their purchasing power. What do those people think back on? Of course, the stuff that was popular and interested them when they were kids, 20 years prior.
(This post was edited by krisAHQ on Mar 17, 2012, 9:12 PM)
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Apprentice
Posted:
Mar 16, 2012, 10:35 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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I didn't grow up with the classic Disney shows. But when I watched them (When I became 17) I was really impressed by how intelligently written these shows were.
I've even compared old shows to modern shows. Old shows stay true to the rules on how a story should be written. In modern Disney sitcoms, they make a extremely short story long by adding in a bunch of random jokes.
A lot of other things matter too. Such as humor, characters, concepts, etc.
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"I hope I didn't hurt you too much when I killed you"-Elmer Fudd, Duck! Rabbit! Duck!
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Supervising Animator
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Mar 19, 2012, 6:19 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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Well...next Monday...Disney Junior will be launched and I hope The Disney Channel will go back to playing the older stuff, but that's like me getting my grandfather's house in Garfield Hts. that's in foreclosure.
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Thank God for kids who love obscure things-Lee Hazelwood (1929-2007)
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Directing Animator / Contributor
Posted:
Mar 19, 2012, 7:16 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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Well...next Monday...Disney Junior will be launched and I hope The Disney Channel will go back to playing the older stuff, but that's like me getting my grandfather's house in Garfield Hts. that's in foreclosure.
Why would the launch of Disney Junior mean that The Disney Channel would go back to playing it's older shows? I don't see the connection.
At this point, I'd say that a retro program block on The Disney Channel is the best we can expect. I don't see TDC suddenly "going retro" just because Disney Junior has been launched. If Disney had any desire to go that way, it would have happened a long time ago. We may not like the current shows on TDC, but that's what making Disney the most money, and it's what TDC's viewers want to see. This is even the case with the programming on ABC Family, which are IMHO, pure crap.
One only has to look at the current states of Boomerang and TV Land to see that 24/7 retro channels don't work in the long run; it's hard to attract sponsors to advertise on a channel that doesn't show anything new, and viewers tend to get bored with seeing the same episodes with no prospect of new episodes coming down the pike. An "old-school" programming block that could air for 2 to 4 hours a day or night during the channel's non-peak viewing hours is a more feasible idea.
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Visit mine and my twin brother's blog. It goes down smooth.
www.astralcity.blogspot.com
(This post was edited by SpaceDemon on Mar 19, 2012, 7:31 PM)
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Supervising Animator
Posted:
Mar 19, 2012, 7:51 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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Well...next Monday...Disney Junior will be launched and I hope The Disney Channel will go back to playing the older stuff, but that's like me getting my grandfather's house in Garfield Hts. that's in foreclosure. Why would the launch of Disney Junior mean that The Disney Channel would go back to playing it's older shows? I don't see the connection. At this point, I'd say that a retro program block on The Disney Channel is the best we can expect. I don't see TDC suddenly "going retro" just because Disney Junior has been launched. If Disney had any desire to go that way, it would have happened a long time ago. We may not like the current shows on TDC, but that's what making Disney the most money, and it's what TDC's viewers want to see. This is even the case with the programming on ABC Family, which are IMHO, pure crap. One only has to look at the current states of Boomerang and TV Land to see that 24/7 retro channels don't work in the long run; it's hard to attract sponsors to advertise on a channel that doesn't show anything new, and viewers tend to get bored with seeing the same episodes with no prospect of new episodes coming down the pike. An "old-school" programming block that could air for 2 to 4 hours a day or night during the channel's non-peak viewing hours is a more feasible idea.
Well...what I meant was...have a time-slot for the retro shows not have it revert back to where it was, like what TeenNick does.
But...there's always YouTube.
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Thank God for kids who love obscure things-Lee Hazelwood (1929-2007)
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Directing Animator / Contributor
Posted:
Mar 19, 2012, 8:25 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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At this year's Upfront, it was revealed that Disney has greenlit 12 new animated shows (13 counting the recently greenlit Wander Over Yonder) as opposed to 9 new live-action shows, so I think it's safe to say that Disney hasn't turned its' back on animation.
As for Disney Junior, here's a list of the initial schedule* (*subject to change, of course):
12:00AM Mickey Mouse Clubhouse
12:30AM Mickey Mouse Clubhouse
1:00AM Jake and the Never Land Pirates
1:30AM Handy Manny
2:00AM Special Agent Oso
2:30AM Mickey Mouse Clubhouse
3:00AM Higglytown Heroes
3:30AM Higglytown Heroes
4:00AM Johnny and the Sprites
4:30AM Lilo & Stitch: The Series
5:00AM Jungle Cubs
5:30AM 101 Dalmatians
6:00AM Timon & Pumbaa
6:30AM The Little Mermaid
7:00AM Timmy Time
7:30AM 3rd & Bird
8:00AM Imagination Movers
8:30AM Charlie and Lola
9:00AM Jojo’s Circus
9:30AM Rolie Polie Olie
10:00AM Babar and the Adventures of Badou
10:30AM Tinga Tinga Tales
11:00AM The Koala Brothers
11:30AM Stanley
12:00PM Handy Manny
12:30PM Handy Manny
1:00PM Higglytown Heroes
1:30PM Chuggington
2:00PM Special Agent Oso
2:30PM Jungle Junction
3:00PM Mickey’s Great Clubhouse Hunt
4:00PM Doc McStuffins
4:30PM Doc McStuffins
5:00PM Jake and the Never Land Pirates – “Peter Pan Returns!”
6:00PM Toy Story 2
7:30PM Doc McStuffins
8:00PM Gaspard and Lisa
8:30PM Guess How Much I Love You
9:00PM Little Einsteins
9:30PM Jungle Junction
10:00PM Special Agent Oso
10:30PM Higglytown Heroes
11:00PM Chuggington
11:30PM The Koala Brothers
Not a lot of so-called 'Golden Age' Disney shows on there, but keep in mind, Disney Junior is a preschool channel, not a retro channel. However, given that Mickey and the Gang seem to be popular among the tiny tot set, there's always the possibility that somewhere down the line Disney Junior could start airing repackaged collections of classic Disney shorts a la Good Morning, Mickey! and Donald Duck Presents like Disney Channel proper did back at their humble beginnings.
Well...what I meant was...have a time-slot for the retro shows not have it revert back to where it was, like what TeenNick does.
You mean like have a "90's Are All That" style block on TDC, but with Disney Afternoon shows?
Sure, they could do something like that, but first the Powers That Be in charge of the channel would need to be convinced that such a block would get adequte ratings. Like Space Demon said above, the Mouse House could launch a Retro Disney block any time they want to, they just don't want to.
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An unemployed court jester is nobody's fool.
(This post was edited by Starburst on Mar 19, 2012, 8:47 PM)
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Key Animator / Contributor
Posted:
Mar 19, 2012, 8:45 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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Why in all that's good in TV animation did they stop making such awesomeness? Walt Disney Television made the weekday afternoon cartoons for two reasons: firstly, to refresh some of their older characters in the public eye. Chip, Dale and Baloo had been getting dusty before these new animated series came out. Secondly, it spurred an interest in all things Disney, in effect getting the foot of the Disney Corporation in America's doorway.
Now, the younger audience that comprises the majority of the Disney Afternoon's viewers doesn't have much disposable income. They can throw tantrums until Mummy and Poppy buy the wretched merchandise, but that's still a capped revenue source. Once WDTV got its foothold in America's living rooms, they shifted focus to the more lucrative high school kids. The pimply tweens that have income from babysitting, landscaping and paper routes. Maybe burger-flipping, too.
If a huckster if going to spend time and effort fleecing a sucker, he'll want to fleece the woolier sheep. This isn't a "mistake" by Disney; this is how profit-driven corporations work. Now, quit bellyachin' and fork over the loot.
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Apprentice
Posted:
Mar 24, 2012, 3:03 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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There was always a reason why Nick defeated Disney in ratings. Disney thought it was because Nick brought crude humor. But the truth was, Nick's shows had better acting, singing and more character-driven humor.
Nick also gave some good cartoons. Like Fairly Oddparents and Tuff Puppy.
It was when Phineas and Ferb came along that they started to beat Nick up good.
Where did Disney go wrong? They stopped listening to the basic rules of writing a script. They became so blinded by the success of Hannah Montana, that they didn't see why they needed to improve.
If you continue to say "Bring back the old cartoons", they're not going to listen. Instead, suggest that they follow the basic principles of writing a show.I'll hopefully discover that in time, but unless I'm really mistaken, all Disney seems to be good for these days is making pre-teen and early teenage girls become even more warped in their minds with Hannah Montana and other craptastically uncool shows. WHERE DID YOU GO WRONG?
The only reason the Disney sitcoms are popular is because it's filled with romance and laugh tracks.
People can be easily persuaded that something is funny when a bunch of other people are laughing. Which is why they brought in laugh tracks.
As for the romance, it's what the average amount of girls like to see. I mean, why else is Twilight popular?
Twilight has practically has the same plot in every book. Same thing with Disney; they just use 5 different plots and make it a little different.
All I'm saying is that Disney could better. I know it's making a ton of money, but still. Just look at Phineas and Ferb, that whopped Hannah Montana's (Most successful Disney sitcom) ratings big time.
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"I hope I didn't hurt you too much when I killed you"-Elmer Fudd, Duck! Rabbit! Duck!
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Supervising Animator
Posted:
Mar 25, 2012, 7:48 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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You mean like have a "90's Are All That" style block on TDC, but with Disney Afternoon shows?
Sure, they could do something like that, but first the Powers That Be in charge of the channel would need to be convinced that such a block would get adequte ratings. Like Space Demon said above, the Mouse House could launch a Retro Disney block any time they want to, they just don't want to.
Yes...that's what I meant...and that's the problem today with MANY Stations...they want shows that grab ratings...not shows that were played by yesteryear.
It looks like Disney NEVER heard of "Quality over Quality"...I just wish that they'd show ALL the "Disneyland/Wonderful World of Color" on Blu-Ray someday.
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Thank God for kids who love obscure things-Lee Hazelwood (1929-2007)
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Directing Animator / Contributor
Posted:
Mar 25, 2012, 8:28 PM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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To Disney's credit, they have put several of the classic Disney shorts as well as some seasons of some of the Disney Afternoon shows onto home video, and while a Retro Disney network seems out of the question at this point (Disney has neither to money nor the desire to launch a 5th channel), a Vault Disney programming block on Disney Junior doesn't seem like that far-fetched an idea. I know Disney Junior is a preschool channel, not a retro channel, but given how popular Mickey and co. is with the tot set, such a thing seems likely, or at least plausible.
I could see the shorts airing on Junior before Disney Channel proper or XD.
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An unemployed court jester is nobody's fool.
(This post was edited by Starburst on Mar 25, 2012, 8:33 PM)
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Animator
Posted:
Mar 31, 2012, 10:19 AM
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Re: TV series: where did Disney go wrong?
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I myself have recently gotten into Darkwing Duck and agree with you--absolutely awesome show.They even had a comic series by Boom complete with an awesome Duck Tales crossover for the finale.
I remember there being a crossover story arc in all of the Disney comics that were featured in the kids' magazine Disney Adventures. Each part of the story featured in a different issue, and involved all of the comics: Tail Spin, Chip-n-Dale's Rescue Rangers, Goof Troop (that's another one to check out), Duck Tales, and finally, Darkwing Duck. The plot involved a chaos god that had been imprisoned inside of a crystal, and possesses anyone or anything that touches it, and makes them do his bidding. At the end of the Duck Tales plot, Scrooge is seen making a call to his jeweler's in St. Canard, so Scrooge of course calls on Darkwing.
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